Episode 10: Educating Our Children
Robbie Shaw:
This is Champagne Problems, where we come together to explore the gray areas of drinking. This is a judgment free zone where we can all take a look at how we make decisions about our relationship with alcohol. We're back in the studio today to discuss prevention, and more specifically underage drinking prevention.
We have a special guest today, his name is Kurtis Taylor. He is the executive director of Alcohol Drug Council of North Carolina. We are going to dive into information that should benefit all the parents out there that are looking to implement some strategy and education into their parenting efforts.
Patrick Bosley:
This is a touchy subject, and something that we've discussed in previous episodes, but it's something that we absolutely need to talk about. And I feel responsible to talk about it, not only from my perspective as a professional, but as a father.
First, I think it's a good idea for the three of us to clear the air and set some serious intentions for what this conversation is going to look like, because I don't want it to rub people the wrong way. I don't want our listeners to feel like we are in any way, shape, or form shaming or judging anybody for their drinking. And that really needs to be heard before we jump into this conversation, because it's going to be a tough one.
Sam Hamson:
If we take this back to the mission of the podcast, we are here to share information, right? We're just here to inform. Us three share the same approach clinically, of confronting you with the reality of what's happening. So if you're asking for prevention techniques, strategies, it does include what substances you use in your own household, in front of children.
I say all that to say, it's not meant to be shaming or blaming. With the same token, you do have the opportunity to equip your children with the skills, the questions, and the factual data driven information so that they can make their own informed decisions.
Kurtis Taylor on Alcohol Culture and Kids
Patrick Bosley:
I'm really excited about our guest today. I want to welcome Kurtis Taylor to Champagne Problems. Curtis is the executive director of the Alcohol Drug Council of North Carolina, and he also is involved with a lot of other stuff in the community here in North Carolina in regards to substance use.
Kurtis Taylor:
So as my T-shirt says, I am for second chances, right? I'm extremely passionate about helping people transition from incarceration, in a manner to where they'll never, ever return to that situation again in their life. I'm the current co-chair of the North Carolina Substance Use Disorder Federation, I am the chair elect for the Coalition of North Carolina, which combines all three disabilities, that's substance use, mental health, and intellectual and developmental disabilities.
Robbie Shaw:
Kurtis, tell us a little bit about what got you started in this area of work, and what drives your passion for doing what you do.
Kurtis Taylor:
It's pretty simple. My name's Kurtis Taylor and I'm a person in long-term recovery. And what that means for me is that I have not used alcohol or any other substance in over 18 years now. So having lived that experience, going through what I've gone through, and now living the life that I'm living today, it just makes sense that I would be passionate about this particular subject.
Robbie Shaw:
You're in good company. Tell us a little bit about the Alcohol Drug Council of North Carolina and how you're involved in that.
Kurtis Taylor:
At the Alcohol Drug Council of North Carolina, our primary function is that we operate an information and referral hotline. We're unique in that we serve all 100 counties. We service the entire state of North Carolina. Our services are free to the citizens that utilize us. And a lot of folks don't know where to start, where to even begin to look to access services. Our system in the state can be fragmented, it can look very different from urban to rural communities and so on and so forth. So that's where we come in, they call our hotline number, which is 1-800-688-4232.
And one of my staff picks up that phone call, and they go through a series of questions. They do an assessment, if you will, not a clinical assessment, but an assessment to find out, "Okay. So what is the appropriate level of care for this individual? And what types of services might be the best fit?" We're not married to any particular treatment modality or recovery pathway, we embrace and respect all recovery pathways. And we simply connect folks to what we feel like is going to best help them in their current situation.
Alcohol Use in Young People
Robbie Shaw:
So necessary. That is great. Kurtis, so I'm going to transition a little over into the prevention side of things. What do you think the most common misconceptions are around alcohol use in young people?
Kurtis Taylor:
So about 94% of youth feel like alcohol use, or underage drinking rather, is a problem in the state of North Carolina.
That is a serious problem. However, when their parents were asked the same question, only about half of them felt like it was a serious issue. So that's probably the largest misconception of all, is that adults for some reason are pretending like it's not happening, when it is indeed happening.
Patrick Bosley:
That's scary, that the kids are actually seeing the problem that the parents should be helping prevent.
How much of your work revolves around prevention? I know you and I talked about your Talk it Out campaign a little bit, and you guys have been trying to push a little bit more around the prevention aspect. Tell us about that. How are you all getting involved in the community and delivering information around prevention, and what does that look like?
Kurtis Taylor:
Yeah. Well, first I need to say that I'm not a "prevention professional," right? I don't have a prevention degree or certification, or anything of that nature. I am a social worker. I do have a bachelor's in social work, and I am passionate about it. So I'm coming from the standpoint of a person in recovery. My agency is not staffed by prevention professionals. We're more along the lines of connecting folks to resources. However, within our mission and our vision, we do certainly advocate for prevention, early interventions, evidence-based treatment, and respect for all recovery pathways, right?
So one of the things that we were able to do, was to partner up with the ABC Commission's, Talk it Out campaign. And there is a wealth of information, conversation starters, fast facts, everything you could think of. I serve as a Talk it Out NC ambassador, for the prevention of underage drinking specifically. And then one of my staff members, Mr. Hector Mendoza, who's Spanish speaking, is also a Talk it Out campaign ambassador, and he reaches out to the Spanish speaking community.
Sam Hamson:
What do you think makes it so hard for parents to talk to their youth about alcohol?
Kurtis Taylor:
Well, honestly, just stigma. Somebody used the word taboo earlier. There's certain subjects that are just uncomfortable, like having that sex talk with your teenager. Because we stigmatize substance use disorder so heavily in our community, people are ashamed to ask for help when they develop a substance use disorder. And then in the meantime, people are even uncomfortable to talk about the subject, and understand that this is real. It's not like our youth are not being exposed to alcohol. It's such a common issue. Some folks almost look at it like a rite of passage, when in fact it is not. Our youth do not have to subject themselves to the dangers and risks of alcohol use, with their underdeveloped brain.
So I think that the Talk it Out website and Talk it Out campaign is specifically geared towards educating parents, helping parents understand that this is a very important conversation to have, and then giving them tips and strategies on how to move forward and have these all important conversations.
Robbie Shaw:
Would you think that the two overarching strategies are education, which can be provided through community and schools, and then parenting? Would you agree with that, or is there more?
Kurtis Taylor:
There's always more. My son plays basketball, so there's that athletic component with your coaches. Some kids, there's no greater influence in their life than their coach. I experienced some of that when I was growing up.
But I think that's a great start, right? If we have school staff and administration involved, and we have parents involved, then that's a great start. But you gotta understand that kids are getting influenced all over the place. It's in social media, it's just different adults that folks come in contact with. And you don't know who your child is going to gravitate towards, or have the utmost respect for. So it's incumbent upon all adults to get educated about this subject, to have some tools in their toolbox on how to start and have this conversation early and often with all the youth that we come in contact with.
Sam Hamson:
When we're really putting this in a wellness space, I always think about the medical field responsibility of prevention, rather than just treatment, once it's become a substance use disorder, and what a foreign concept it would be for pediatricians to be involved in this space. How would parents really react to that, right? They think if we talk about it, then that makes it happen. But we've got parents who are really underestimating the drinking in general, and the problematic nature of the drinking. I'm just wondering if that's a place, just in our imaginations, in our dream world that could be tapped into, is that child wellness, adolescent, pre-teen wellness realm, and how we could start talking about that in a way that's not taboo, but health-related.
Patrick Bosley:
It's just so crazy to me that we have all this data about alcohol and the brain. But we don't have a consistent message that's coming from teachers, doctors, members of the community, parents. Having this conversation is obviously tough, but I think one of the reasons that it's so tough is that we don't have a solid, concise message that we can deliver to the kids. And I think if we could crystallize that somehow, it may be easier. I'm scared to death to have this conversation with my kids.
My kids are nine, four and six months old, and I am not looking forward to it. Coming from a person that doesn't drink and my wife, she barely drinks, I still don't know. I know Robbie's got a young daughter in junior high, and Kurtis, I know your son just started college. Have you had these conversations with your son? How do you approach this as a dad? Because I can talk about clinical jargon, but when it comes to me and my own family, I don't know what the hell I'm doing. Help. Help.
Kurtis Taylor:
Obviously everybody has to find their own strategy. Personally, after what I went through in active substance use, I took the approach of diving in head first. I'm a public speaker and one of the things that I've had the opportunity to do many, many times, is share my story in public. But the most important place that I share my story is at home. My kids are the most important things on the planet to me. So they got my story before anybody else did. My daughter was actually old enough to remember bits and pieces of what was going on, and come to find out, there was even a little bit of trauma related to parts of my returns to use.
What I've discovered is that pretending like it doesn't exist, or like Samantha stated like, "Oh, so talking about is going to make it happen." Those are myths. Those are misconceptions. So I'm absolutely upfront with my kids. They understand that their father is not a perfect person. But they also understand that there's not a perfect person walking this earth. And I think leveling the playing field in our hearts allows us to be much more comfortable having this conversation.
Sam Hamson:
It's almost like if we allow the discomfort to seep in, we're making it about us, instead of really what the little ones deserve to know. Because I love what you're talking about, Patrick, of this crystallized, unified message, and how powerful that would be if it was across social media wellness in schools and parenting. And then we all just found an individual strategy that we were most comfortable with to communicate that same message, our kids wouldn't be confused.
Kurtis Taylor:
Parents have much more influence on their kids than they realize. A lot of times kids act like what we say doesn't matter to them, but when they get away from us, the seeds that we planted in them, they're grown. One thing that we've come to understand when we talk about evidence-based strategies is that scare tactics don't work with teenagers. So it's not about trying to scare somebody straight, it's more so about simply educating. Providing our youth, and adults for that matter, with accurate information, the scientific data, and then allowing them to use that information to hopefully make more healthy choices and decisions in their life.
Nearly two thirds of middle school and high school age youth know people around their own age that have tried alcohol. The average age that a kid tries alcohol for the first time in North Carolina is 14 years old. Personally, I was 12. 38% of eighth graders have had alcohol, at least one time. About 10% of 12 year olds say that they've tried alcohol, but by age 15, that number jumps up to 50%. More teens die as a result of alcohol use than all other illicit drugs combined. In North Carolina, one person dies every single week as a result of underage drinking.
Sam Hamson:
I just got chills. I hate that I'm in the field and don't even know those stats. That just shows you how much we don't talk about it.
Because those numbers are reflected in adulthood too if you look at the killer of humans, it's alcohol versus all other drugs by a vast majority. So none of that is shocking, it's something that's really starting at an incredibly early age, it sounds like.
Robbie Shaw:
It feels like there is some sort of puzzle that we are having trouble figuring out. And I love what Patrick said, and you as well, Kurtis, about trying to get everybody on the same page, and that is a tough goal, because you have to incorporate the fact that many parents drink problematically. So if you're a parent and you drink, albeit maybe at a very low level, but you do drink to an extent that it seems a little abnormal. How do you educate your own child?
Patrick Bosley:
I don't know how it could possibly be effective to have problematic drinking going on in the home. And again, when we talk about problematic drinking from a scientific standpoint, we'll refer back to earlier episodes, what's that? About 14 drinks a week for men and seven for women, anything more than that is considered heavy drinking. But if more than that's going on in the home, and you're trying to have a conversation with your kid about not drinking, and they're seeing the total opposite of what you're telling them, how can you reconcile that? The only answer I can come up with is, as parents and as adults, if we do have kids, we have to model healthy behavior.
Curtis Taylor:
That's one of the things that I'm impressed so much with about the Talk it Out NC campaign, is that there's an aspect of the campaign that's called take the pledge. So there's a pledge card. And on one side, the young person is pledging this series of things that they're committing themselves to. But the other side is the adult, the parents normally, and they're taking this pledge. And one of the items listed in their pledge, they are pledging to drink responsibly, to show responsible behavior around this particular substance, especially in front of their young folks. We might not have that crystallized, one size fits all message for everybody to embrace, but I think if we could get all North Carolina citizens to visit that Talk it Out website, and maybe go ahead and decide to take that pledge with their youth, we'd be off to a tremendous start.
Sam Hamson:
It's really tough, because I think back to the young folks that I've worked with, their parents will come in and say, "I'll do anything to make sure that this kid doesn't go down the wrong path." And I'll say, "Well, what about reducing your drinking at home?" "I'll do anything but that." And not in a shaming way, but just understanding that part of prevention is also the modeling, is also what's happening in the home, it is also what they're learning by observation, not by just the sit down talks that you have.
Patrick Bosley:
With your work in this space, at the level that you're at, how's the response been from community leaders, from community partners in your speaking engagements, and when you're meeting people that are outside the alcohol and drug treatment or prevention realm? Do you feel like people are actually starting to pay more attention to this subject?
Kurtis Taylor:
I do. And I'll be the first one to admit, I am an optimist. But I think that one of the things - because the opioid epidemic has been dealt with so much differently than the crack cocaine epidemic that hit our country - that as a result, folks are taking a good, hard look at all substance use disorders, not just opiates. I think people are finally understanding that most people use more than one thing, first of all. And that it's not an opioid problem, it's a substance issue and it's a health issue. It's not a moral issue, it's a wellness issue.
Talking to Children About Alcohol
Patrick Bosley:
Can you give us the rundown on language? Just for the average listener that doesn't come from the addiction recovery world.
Kurtis Taylor:
So, for example, when I introduced myself, I said, "My name is Kurtis Taylor, and I'm a person in long term recovery." And then I went on to tell you what that meant for me. And that, in and of itself, if you think about the mental imagery that takes place in the mind when you hear me say that, as opposed to me saying something like, "Well, I'm an addict." Or, "I'm dealing with substance abuse." Those terms have a negative connotation to them. Number one, the word abuse, it places the blame at my feet, like I'm an abuser type person. That's negative mental imagery, it's blaming. And we don't call folks with diabetes, sugar abusers, right? That doesn't even sound right. We need to begin to be very conscious of language choice, and make sure that we're using terminology that does not perpetuate stigma. As a matter of fact, we can use terminology that helps eliminate it.
Not only do the substances lower inhibitions, but you're dealing with that primitive human survival reward control pathway. So the example that I always give to an audience is, I ask everybody, "Okay. So who in here can decide to hold their breath forever and not breathe again? Ready, set, go." And everybody laughs and obviously human beings, we're not equipped to do that. And the reason why is because there's a survival system inherent in every human being, that will annihilate that particular piece of willpower that you think you have, your lungs will absolutely kick in and you will take a breath, and you can't override it, right? So I asked the folks, I said, "Well, are you weak because you can't decide to hold your own breath? Are you morally flawed because you can't do that?"
And of course the answer's no. In that person's brain that's dealing with that substance use disorder, that particular substance is that driving force. That's the same mechanism within their system that is telling them, basically what to do, every minute of the day. That particular substance has now become more important than eating, sleeping, drinking, all basic human survival skills. The substance is their general, their lieutenant, their sergeant. And they can't just express willpower to overcome it. It doesn't work that way.
Sam Hamson:
To bring it full circle, why prevention with young people is so important, because if you're talking about that system being rewired and formed that way, right? When you've got the amygdala in the brain holding onto that memory from age 12 or 14. And that brain is learning at such a young age that that's something it needs to survive, and avoid pain and discomfort and seek pleasure. That doesn't go away, by saying, "You're grounded if you drink."
Kurtis Taylor:
So the earlier that someone is exposed to alcohol, then the higher their risk of developing a substance use disorder, full blown. I wish I had the statistics verbatim, but it's something like 40 times more likely. So kids that drink under age are 40 or 41 times more likely to develop a substance use disorder, than kids who just simply wait at least until they're 21.
Robbie Shaw:
Yeah. My mother had that question for me recently. She said, "Now, is that real? Is that your experience?" And I said, "I started drinking at 12." Like you Kurtis, "And everybody that I was drinking with, we're all in recovery. All of us." So yeah. Yeah. Very true. Very, very true.
Patrick Bosley:
One last question, Kurtis, and you might have already answered this. But if you could give parents and community leaders one piece of advice about starting effective conversations around prevention, what would it be?
Kurtis Taylor:
Visit talkitoutnc.org, for real. There's so much up there that can help. But do not allow fear or anxiety prevent you from having this conversation. And that's whether it's with a young person, or whether it's with a legislator, or a business leader, you name it. As a community, we need to be having this conversation with one another. Some folks might be considered an expert, but the reality is that if you're human, then you're learning every day. So don't be afraid, don't be ashamed, don't be anxious about making a mistake or saying something wrong. By all means, educate yourself and try to prepare for these conversations.
Alcohol and Wellness: Giving Kids the Facts
Sam Hamson:
Patrick, when you said, I can have all the information and all the clinical jargon, but when it comes to my kids, it doesn't change the fact that that's big and scary and there's a lot of responsibility there. Can you talk a little bit about that?
Patrick Bosley:
Yeah. Well, I can talk about the fact that my oldest son is nine. And he thinks right now that if he takes a sip of alcohol it will kill him. So that's how I prevent things in my household.
Sam Hamson:
I'm really interested in that idea of scare tactics not working with teenagers, because if you think about how invincible they think they are, whatever you shared with them is going to happen, there's that defiance and invincibility where they're like, "Well, that's not going to happen to me, so I'm going to do it and create my own outcome." Versus really giving the actual information on what happens when you do drink, what the actual risks are, what's happening in your brain. Like Robbie said, they're hungry for it, right? They want to see it. And then they want to see responsible adults backing that up and modeling some of that behavior.
Patrick Bosley:
It's like, it might even be more powerful for the information to come outside of the household. Because I think so many parents are avoiding this conversation, because they don't want to look at their own drinking, even if it's not that much, it's like, "Well shit, if I have this conversation with my kid, I'm going to have to start hiding my beer." And it's not even problematic drinkers, it's people that drink socially or maybe one or two drinks a night. Those one or two drinks are so valuable to them at the end of the day, that it's like, "Well, if I have this conversation with my kid, then-"
Sam Hamson:
So is the ideal situation shared responsibility around educating our youth? If you've got young people in your lives, make sure that this is something that you're talking about, asking about, and provide an open door for?
Robbie Shaw:
Absolutely. I think there's some sort of age threshold. Where kids are listening and then they stop. I mean, my daughter is really close to stopping listening. And I had my window up until when she turned 12 or 13. She's not listening as much anymore.
Sam Hamson:
Where's the teacher? Where's the therapist? Where's the coach? Where's the grown up that is responsible? And how can we all share that responsibility so that as these young people go through their phases, they've always got an open door to talk about, they've always got a safe space.
Patrick Bosley:
The more that we mine the facts out and crystallize this message around what alcohol does to the brain, these are the facts, these are your risks. That means that it doesn't have to come from any single source, because everybody's fallible. We're human beings. And if it's coming from a parent, it's coming from a community leader... And then the next thing you know, that community leader gets arrested or you see your parents drunk at a party. It's like, "Okay. Well, obviously none of that meant anything." So I think that's where the important piece of us getting our ducks in a row and figuring out how this message needs to be delivered. And it doesn't need to be delivered in a shaming way or a, this is the right thing to do or moral thing for you to do, is not to drink. We just need to get our story straight.
Robbie Shaw:
Yeah. The information. I mean, everything that we're covering here is meant to inform, and then you can make your decision, but you've got to be informed.
Sam Hamson:
Can you imagine if one of the assignments in health class in middle school or high school was to actually spend a certain amount of hours on Talk it Out, if that was part of a health screening at school, that your school nurse was actually asking you about alcohol use, not just safe sex, those sorts of things. But they were actually asking about alcohol use.
So one of the questions we get a lot is, if we've got a young person in our life that's, let's say they're in their teens. How do I start this conversation? What questions do I ask? What do I share with them? And what's appropriate?
Patrick Bosley:
These are my first thoughts on it. It's one of two things, it's like you either don't drink around them, or maybe you're not the one to have the conversation with them.
Robbie Shaw:
Or you don't tell them not to drink. You have a conversation about it. I've got a mentee that I've been with for eight years, and now he is reaching high school. So we have had these conversations, he knows I don't drink. He doesn't quite grasp it, but he definitely talks about things like, "Hey, give me a beer. Let me get that beer." And he's totally joking, he hasn't drunk yet, he assures me. But the conversation around it is much less about, here's why it's so bad, it's more, "Let's talk about who your friends that are doing it, why are doing it? When I was your age, I did this, and some of my friends didn't. When I got there later it turned into this."
Patrick Bosley:
But here's my issue with it, if we take that approach and it's like, "Okay. Well, if you're a moderate drinker, what does that mean?" Where I think we could really mess up as adults and people that are moderate drinkers, is if you believe you're a moderate drinker, but you're drinking five or six drinks a night, if that is considered moderation for you, maybe you're not the right one to have that conversation.
Sam Hamson:
I would take the complete opposite approach, because I'm going to assume if I'm in the life of a young person and it's not my child, I'm going to make the assumption that someone, somewhere is already telling them what they should and shouldn't be doing. I'm going to come at it from much more of a place of like, "Hey, do you have any questions about alcohol? Do you have any questions about how your friends drink? Do you know this about alcohol?" And more of an exploratory and sharing if prompt way, but I'm not sharing just to be another adult that's like telling them about my experience. And you've got to be really prepared when you're opening up these conversations for them to go, "Yeah. Why do you drink?"
Patrick Bosley:
That's the key. And I'm afraid that if the push culturally is like, "Yeah, talk to your kids about drinking." And if you are not prepared with the facts, and you're not prepared to answer those questions, you can actually end up doing more harm than good.
Sam Hamson:
I think creating some of that open space, knowing that they're so hungry of, "Hey, are there any questions that you have about alcohol? And let's make sure we get you those answers." Not, "I am the expert and have the answers because I drink alcohol." But we can go to Talk it Out, we can go to some of these other resources that already exist for education that are scientific based. What are some of the things you've heard about alcohol? What do your friends say about it? What do your parents say about it? And really just understand where the kid is at with it, because a lot of it's going to start from there. If they've never drank and they're terrified of it, we're in a different place than a kid that's like, "Well, I drink about the same amount as my dad, and that's X amount per week."
This is why people don't get into it, right? Because it's tough and it feels hypocritical. And we're saying, "Hey, talk to them about it." But it also feels like we're saying, "But don't talk to them about it if you're not modeling what you would want to see in them." And there's got to be a little bit of distinction, when you're sharing scientific information about what low risk is, sorry, but there is a difference between an adolescent brain and an adult brain. So while it is safe-ish, for me to have one drink on one occasion, it's not safe for an adolescent to have one drink on one occasion.
Patrick Bosley:
Where my mind goes with that is, what is the most effective delivery method of that information? And is it coming from a teacher? Is it coming from a primary care doctor? Or is it coming from a parent that moderately drinks? Because if we screw up that avenue, that information, it becomes weak.
Sam Hamson:
So can there be some separation between what you're allowed to do while living in this household, and what the science is, because right now the only thing they know is what they're allowed to do or not allowed to do. So if we put some of the education back in wellness, in medical, in an education piece, then we're coming at it from facts about alcohol use. And at the end of the day, parents are still going to decide what's allowed in their household or not.
Robbie Shaw:
The first thing that comes to my mind is just the difference in kids. There's just no one stroke, every kid is different. Some listen to their parents, some don't. Some listen to their coaches, some don't play sports. It's just how to figure out what the avenue is to deliver the information.
Sam Hamson:
We've just got to provide the best opportunity. If you think about your job as a parent, right? I've heard most parents describe that as, "I just want to give my kid the best opportunity to succeed." Whatever that means for them. And this isn't, "Hey, you're responsible for the outcome." You're just responsible for what you're putting in front of them, and hoping that they really do something healthy with that, that it equips them. The whole mission of our podcast is to equip with information. And as parents, that's what we're asking for is just, let's equip them, let's give them the best opportunity to make the best decisions with this thing. It doesn't mean if they don't do it, that it's all your fault.
Robbie Shaw:
Well, and let's also throw this in there, because if you dig into the information and look at the statistics, being sensitive to shaming, we also can't deny some of the facts. And the facts are that underage drinking takes place more times inside a household where problematic drinking is going on. That is a fact. So as much as I don't want to shame a parent, as much as I am sensitive to all of this stuff, that is the truth. And it's something everybody needs to understand prior to all of these things that we're talking about. The fact is, if there's a lot of drinking going on in your house, it's not working in your favor.
Sam Hamson:
Yeah. It might be the first step to prevention with your kids at least, taking a look at your own alcohol use. Maybe not what anyone wants to hear, but maybe one of the strongest pieces of evidence.
Robbie Shaw:
So educate yourself. There are ways to do it. And I really like what Kurtis said about having the courage and not letting your fear and anxiety get in the way of starting these conversations. We have to start somewhere, and we can't act like this isn't an issue. Because these are kids and their brains are developing.
Sam Hamson:
For me it's really the person-first language. The minute we can go person first, we've already taken down some of the taboo, stigma around this discussion. And the majority of our podcast is just about being able to get the information out there, and being willing to start these conversations in the community, in the home and that sort of thing. And we've got to start with really caring language that gets us outside of ourselves, and ready to equip others with what they need to know to make the best decisions. I'm a big fan of today. Y'all know prevention's my jam.
Robbie Shaw:
Can you talk to my kids, please? The information and opinion shared on this podcast are solely those of the hosts and guests, and are not a substitute for medical advice. If you feel like you may need professional help, here are some resources. For the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration hotline, call 1-800-662-4357, or visit smsa.gov. For listeners in the Charlotte, North Carolina community, visit dilworthcenter.org, or call all 704-372-6969, or visit theblanchardinstitute.com, or call 704-288-1097.